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Beware The Tune

63K views 283 replies 62 participants last post by  Smitman 
#1 ·
For all you owners who are considering tuning your Cats...think twice. I ordered a tune, PCM, and pulley package from a well know tuner who specializes in Hellcats. I asked for a 91 Octane tune. they said they were sending a safe 'pump gas' tune. I asked them if it was safe to take it to the track and then data log it there. they said yes. They said be sure that you do a pull, and the air/fuel was around 11.5, we did, it was. Sooo 2 passes down the track and my car starts cutting out like crazy. thinking i had fouled the plugs, we pulled them...and horrified found that the pistons had contacted the plugs, crunching the electrodes. We then scoped the cylinders to find damaged pistons. After a complete tear down, we found damaged pistons, damaged heads , and bits of pistons found all the way to the cats. After contacting back with the tuner, he said they sent a 93 tune, and that is what was requested ( no it was not). They also said maybe it ran lean, because the tune was not loaded right...Of course no one is taking responsibility. ...because ultimately it was my call to tune the car. I am restoring the car back to stock. New long block and labor...15K. ( if my blower had been bad, you can add another 9K). I know there are many success stories out there on tuning, and i think thats awesome. But my car staying complete and reliable with warranty is more important to me than being a half second quicker. SRT told me that they are seeing quite a few blown motors due to tuning mistakes. Buyer beware. FOR SALE...PCM, Pulley, and Diablo Trinity. PM me for details.
 
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#3 ·
:eek::eek::eek::eek: WOW....that sucks. Really sorry to hear that. I'm in the on the fence bunch myself...this is my worst nightmare.
 
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#8 ·
Doesn't sound right...physical impossibility as these items have fixed physical dimensions.

Tune can't lengthen a connection rod, raise a piston top or a make a spark plug longer so there is no way that the piston met with the spark plug.

Now debris from burn internals could contact the piston face and plug. That's possible!
 
#12 ·
Doesn't sound right...physical impossibility as these items have fixed physical dimensions.

Tune can't lengthen a connection rod, raise a piston top or a make a spark plug longer so there is no way that the piston met with the spark plug.

Now debris from burn internals could contact the piston face and plug. That's possible!
SRT is where i got this info from. Nuff said.
 
#14 ·
That really sucks to hear but hope it get's back together without issues. As for the damage, guessing there was detonation from too much timing and broken pieces made contact with the plug destroying the tip.
 
#15 ·
I will agree with this...but did the tuner also disable the knock sensors? Sorry, the computer will pull timing and the car fall flat long before it detonates badly enough to do this running 91 on a 93 tune. Fuels are really too close and you can get crappy fuel at any time - car won't gernade itself - just run like crap

Now, run a race gas tune on pump 91 - I could see it

I hope I don't pick the same mystery tuner when the time comes

Sorry to hear about the bad luck
 
#31 · (Edited)
...I agree! The beauty of this car was you buying a 707 HP car with a warranty....otherwise you could have purchased for half the price one without and made it just as fast...hell buy a C6 2008 corvette for 28k and you will be at 700hp with a supercharger,headers, tune etc.Upgrade the suspension and drivetrain you will be around 48k all in - I know because I did it....


Seriously guys if your a track hound going to the track every week/month why would you get some lame "send a tune"...go to a reputable shop and have them put it on the dyno and tune it right ....and not lean....We used to do the send a tunes on our SRT4's ( a 12k car) :D
 
#21 ·
Subscribed...

OP, mistakes do happen, and I respect your desire to take the high road and not unduly trash a vendor. It seems like there is more to this story, which you did seemingly post with the intention of helping out the community, and maybe with the purpose of venting, which I completely understand. Nobody can typically absorb a $15K bill and not cringe a bit, or even a lot. I know that I would not only have some explaining to do to my other half, but I'd be looking for where to even get $15K in cash to fix everything. (...and why a long block, a short block could do it?)

But in order for this to truly be helpful to us, and it really can, I think you're going to need to share another level of the details of this tragedy. Pictures of the pistons and heads for example. A bit of clarity on the 91 vs 93, which as others have stated, seems insignificant. 91 vs 101/race, maybe?

I'm not sure how old the event is, but maybe take a day to two (or three?) to let this settle out and consider posting more details. Just think of all of the Internet Brownie Points you'll earn if you save even just one other HC from physical damage.

.02
 
#22 ·
??? does a short block include the heads??? Sorry for your situation hope you get the "ride" back together soon. Helps confirm "when" I get my HC a 3.09 diff is about as far as I am willing $$$$'s too, make mods, leave the engine, trans, stock, and ride out the warranty.
 
#29 ·
I think your doing the hellcat community a injustice by not naming them. What if it happens to someone else and this company doesn't learn.
Well I've been on the SRT forums since 2007 and I bet I've seen millions of dollars sent to vendors that either haven't delivered or outright scammed people and yet the posters come in to many forums and start these threads and yet never seem to want to mention the vendors ....... whatever the silly reason goes thru their heads.....

After a while I don't have much sympathy for these posters because they don't want to name names... just want to gripe..
And want to "Warn People" ...the bottom line is................

What and who are you warning me about???

For me I gotta say go home and lick your wounds in silence....... because you have wasted my time reading.... without giving me anything concrete.
 
#30 ·
I have been around the modern Mopar forums for about 11 years and never have I read about a major issue with any of the trusted tuners like Hemituner, HHP, Johan and others. The only time I have seen an issue like the OP had was using a tuner that doesn't have real experience with Mopars. A tuner can be well known for tuning Ford or Chevys but tuning a Mopar is a different animal. The OP's experience may not even be the tuner's fault. If you search this forum you will find a few completely stock engines that have blown.
 
#33 ·
Help me understand how a tune led to pistons contacting spark plugs? Thanks
Was told that if it ran too lean, this could be the result.
SRT is where i got this info from. Nuff said.
Impossible. Period. I don't care who you think you heard what from; a nice receptionist answering phones maybe, but not anyone that knows what they're talking about.


It would have to detonate pretty bad and break/melt the piston(s) before it made contact. But a tune in itself will never, ever, ever, lead to piston/spark plug/valve contact. A tune can't overcome physical properties....

Sucks. You're doing no one any good by being secretive about who tuned. It's not knocking them, it's being honest. Shit happens, the best of the best of the best on occasion have a bad day, doesn't matter what they're into.
 
#37 ·
This is useless thread then, everyone has had excellent results with a tune. I am truly sorry you have had this issue but without knowing who's tune to beware of doesn't really help out anyone else. Maybe someone else has had this issue also but is waiting for someone to verify.
 
#40 ·
I had hoped that this thread would give some insight into my tuning disaster . I'm not going to argue the what ifs with any keyboard tuning experts. There have been many great experiences with tuned Hellcats, and like I said that is awesome. I take responsibility for my decision. Good luck gentleman.
 
#50 ·
Well having built more engines than I can count over 40 years, What SRT told you is impossible.The piston would have had to breakup, or the rod would have to let go, in order to hit the spark plug. A tune would have to be truly messed up all of a sudden,to do this. If it were that messed up at idle it would not have ran. So Good luck on the new engine. And keep it stock.
 
#44 ·
I don't have the answers as to why it happened, nor does the tuner, the dealership service tech, the area Dodge service tech, or SRT. Their guess was it probably ran way too lean. But no one knows for sure. It happened to me, it could happen to you.
 
#43 ·
Please allow me to defend the OP for just a moment.

The OP started a thread to discuss his experience with a tune. He has no obligation to make his thread of any value. We may wish he would have made full disclosure of all aspects of the event. He feels to not "point fingers". That is his right.

Can you imagine the push back had he named HHP? Maybe he doesn't feel the event was soley caused by the tune, and thus, naming the tuner would unnecessarily damage a man's reputation, when it might not have been the cause.

Benefit: Assuming the OP is expressing his objective belief, we should progress cautiously any "warranty delete" decision. And that is not a bad thing.
 
#46 ·
Please allow me to defend the OP for just a moment.

The OP started a thread to discuss his experience with a tune. He has no obligation to make his thread of any value. We may wish he would have made full disclosure of all aspects of the event. He feels to not "point fingers". That is his right.

Can you imagine the push back had he named HHP? Maybe he doesn't feel the event was soley caused by the tune, and thus, naming the tuner would unnecessarily damage a man's reputation, when it might not have been the cause.

Benefit: Assuming the OP is expressing his objective belief, we should progress cautiously any "warranty delete" decision. And that is not a bad thing.

Well the tuners have just lost my business anyway because now I will not get a tune from any of "them".
 
#45 ·
Maybe the moral of the story is to not disable the knock sensors? At least not until you know things are "dialed in" correctly? Because, it does not seem like physically a tune will cause the piston to hit a plug. But after some holes were burnt through some things and it got real hot, then things can come apart. That makes some sense of it for me. Bad deal dude.
 
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