The Truth

Discussion in 'SRT Hellcat Performance' started by goingsolo2, Aug 21, 2015.

  1. goingsolo2

    goingsolo2 Beast will be back bigger and better than ever! Hellcat Car Club Gold Supporting Member Hellcat Supporting Vendor

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    The Truth:

    Before we became vendors here in the Hellcat community, I was here as a member and still as a proud Hellcat owner. It has been very disheartening reading the pages and pages of different posts regarding airflow modifications and the power they provide, or don't provide for that matter. We can all agree that the Hellcat is a well engineered high performance car that is meant for the true enthusiast to enjoy year after year as one of the special treasures in the auto world. With that being said, there has been so much debate as to the effectiveness of intakes, etc. Posting dyno numbers making claims of huge power gains is inaccurate and frankly, not truthful unless consistent track testing is done and documented. On a supercharged car, and many other vehicles, intakes and exhaust kits by themselves are supporting modifications...that is all. The Hellcat runs slightly lean from the factory. We did testing on the dyno with my untuned Hellcat with an intake and catback. The BWoody intake flows over 600cfm more than stock and the Solo Performance Catback is way more free slowing than stock. You can not take advantage of the added airflow without accommodating the increased airflow with more fuel. The ECU will not do that on its own. During our untuned run, we had a small amount of timing pulled from the heat and running slightly lean. It was still safe to drive daily, as I did, but it was not optimal to make tons of power. As soon as fuel was added through Hemituner making adjustments, timing immediately came back and we made considerable power for 8 runs in 90 degree heat.

    Does the BWoody intake flow at 1900+cfm? YES
    Does it make the supercharger sound awesome? YES
    Will it make power from appropriate tuning? YES
    Should anyone think that any intake will add considerable power without tuning? NO
    Safe to drive without tuning? YES

    Does the Solo Performance 3" X Pipe kit flow better than stock? YES
    Does is sound better? HELL YEA
    Should anyone think you'll make a ton of power without tuning? NO
    Safe to drive without tuning? YES

    The fact that the car runs lean from the factory and can't take advantage of added airflow without tuning is why members saw the results they did testing other products. That would be my educated guess.

    Mike at BWoody is testing a new MAF that might be the answer to not requiring tuning. Stay tuned on that! We will also be offering packages with the Solo Exhaust, BWoody intake, and tuning from Hemituner. Mike is already offering a package for the exhaust and intake, and then you can call AJ (Hemituner) and he can educate you and the different ways he can tune for the modifications.

    When I promoted the Solo kit, I said from the beginning that we recommend tuning to take advantage of the added flow. Mike at BWoody promoted the intake as the best flowing one on the market, and backed it up with the flow bench testing sheets. We have seen a tenth gained at track without tuning with the BWoody...so can it help without tuning...yes...will it be huge numbers...not without tuning. The number that's huge is the flow it provides and what opportunities that opens up in the tuning, or possibly the new MAF sensor they're working on.

    This community should be banded together and wanting vendors to support it. As a vendor, I am on over 15 forums myself, and three others as a past enthusiast owner. Honest feedback is fantastic, but lots of these products are new and the feedback is what enables us to improve the product. I'm testing them on my own daily driver. I want improvements just as much as everyone else. Everyone makes mistakes, even vendors...but how we handle mistakes proves our worth. A positive attitude really helps benefit everyone. We are seeing some great things on cars such as Top Cats and Ross's. They're running different setups and really showing us how great this car is. Let's all try to be positive, communicate with vendors privately before taking to public posting, and show the love that this piece of automotive history deserves. I am the rep for Solo Performance and by all means, if I treat you poorly, call me out! I pride my own reputation and represent the company on honesty, excellent customer service, and actually loving the automotive world. I apologize for the rant, but hopefully this helps us all get on the same page and really make incredible things happen for the SRT/Hellcat.
     
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  2. Hollywood

    Hollywood Silver Member

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    Somebody brief me on this book when it's published!
     
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  3. Snappycat

    Snappycat SRT Hellcat Moderator Staff Member

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    Solo, well said and written. I am not very mechanically inclined. Your post has given me a good understanding of the mod possibilities and their related performance expectations. I will most likely keep my kitty stock...at least for the near future, but knowing what is being developed in the aftermarket/mod industry is good to know. Thanks for sharing your thought and educating regular guys like myself:):)
     
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  4. Harley88

    Harley88 Gold Member

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    But who is responsible for irresponsible vendors?
    When a vendor is allowed to arguable lie, cheat and steal ( yes! AFe ) without any reprocussions it stains the water for all other vendors. sure the site needs revenue to exist; but at what price? And really at who's expense?
    With the crap AFE pulled and got away with All Vendors Got/get hurt.
    Is it negative to call BS, bs?
    And when vendors know that other vendors are being arguably dishonest; is there a responsibility to call them out?
    By not doing do, in the the long run are you not hurting yourself as well as your potential client ?
     
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  5. B5 Blue

    B5 Blue Platinum Member

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    Was this tenth you gained with CAI or with exhaust or both? Was this at a dragstrip with time slips?
     
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  6. Billet Hellcat

    Billet Hellcat Gold Member

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    I agree with Solo and want vendors to make products for the HC and don't want them to see all the negitive comments on here and not want to make products for us.
    aFe did get us pumped up on bolt on hp that did not deliver and took a beating but aFe did stand behind there product and gave full refunds to all that returned them. (And let me keep the hat, shirt & cleaning kit) does it make it right no but cost them money and sales.

    BWoody did not come on hear and promised big hp numbers just proved his intake has high flow numbers and would shine with a tune and higher boost but I think he got some aFe leftover crap. Is that right No.

    Solo Exhaust great company I purchased a cat back system for my Pontiac G8 and call them up with a drone at a certain rpm they sent me a pair of $200+ resonators free no problem to make me the cust happy.

    Most HC owners will not go with a tune (warranty) and if you don't want to pay for or can't afford too buy a motor / trans , axles etc... You probably should not get a tune. But if you like the looks and sound of a cai or exhaust, catch can , wheels , lowering kit, billet goodys cool it's your car and nice to have a few different choices to buy from. The Hellcat is a amazing car and we will see some great products in the upcoming months I hope we get them first here on Hellcat.org. Peace.
     
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  7. Next Phase

    Next Phase Silver Member

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    (double post)
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2015
  8. Next Phase

    Next Phase Silver Member

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    I'm glad to see vendors here supporting our platform and thanks for all that you do!

    With that said, I've spent enough money on aftermarket parts and modifications over the last decade to buy a Lambo (literally....unfortunately). I've made countless trips to the dyno to test out hp claims and frankly disappointed with the results. (Don't ask me to provide examples...it will awaken the angey sharks)

    I understand that you need a tune to take advantage of modifications but I have rarely seen an intake or cat back make any considerable gains (atleast when compared to the cost). For me, the sound of the intake and exhaust are the reasons I buy a CAI or an exhaust - not performance gains.

    I don't want to shit on this thread, but I'd love to see a stock Hellcat with just a tune (dyno numbers) versus a cai and exhaust HC with a tune to see what kind of gains you would get.

    (For me personally, I'm not going to tune my HC until the warranty expires. It's one of the reasons I bought the car. I've had countless modified cars and know what it takes to get them dialed in. It's never as easy as people make it seem on the forums and they are never as relaible as a stock car. More hp = more problems.)

    I know this forum is pretty sensitive about this subject but we feel we were being sold a product that did not produce the advertised hp gains. I'm one of them. So you can't blame us for being a bit skeptical.

     
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  9. VanishingPoint

    VanishingPoint Silver Member

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    I support truth in advertising.
     
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  10. mike@bwp

    mike@bwp Gold Member Hellcat Supporting Vendor

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    Well said Steve, woke up this morning and read this and I couldn't agree more. Guy's as vendors were sorry when another vendor comes along and gives you inflated claims, but its not every other vendors fault. Guys neither BWoody nor SOLO has promised nor stated any horsepower gains for the Hellcat, what we have promised are two units to outflow OEM to support future mods or tuning. Steve went out of his way to make an appointment with AJ to get a base line tune to see what the car needed to make power with the Intake and the exhaust he made 23 WHP by just added a small amount of fuel. AJ states the car is running lean from the factory and the two airflow mods are making the car run a bit leaner which is why many seeing little to no power. Fortunately for the community BWoody, SOLO, and Hemituner are all investing time and money on solutions for the vehicle, it takes time and a lot of money it's not gonna happen over night and being negative or bashing is not going to speed it up, were not here to make a part, sell it then run like other's, all three of us are dedicated Hellcat owners that want big power as well.
     
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  11. goingsolo2

    goingsolo2 Beast will be back bigger and better than ever! Hellcat Car Club Gold Supporting Member Hellcat Supporting Vendor

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    I don't want to speak for them because it's not professional, but I did write that if I provide poor service to people, then by all means call me out! That should be universal, but after its at least tried to be dealt with privately.
     
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  12. goingsolo2

    goingsolo2 Beast will be back bigger and better than ever! Hellcat Car Club Gold Supporting Member Hellcat Supporting Vendor

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    I don't blame you one bit. I was on that list for the original CAI that had an issue with members here. I went another direction in the end, and I totally understand it leaving a bad taste in people's mouth. I'm trying to build people's confidence in the aftermarket here again.
     
  13. goingsolo2

    goingsolo2 Beast will be back bigger and better than ever! Hellcat Car Club Gold Supporting Member Hellcat Supporting Vendor

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    I believe it was an apples to apples swap on Linda's car. Its written in another thread, so I'd prefer not getting into it in this one. Post about it in the thread dedicated to that. Thanks.
     
  14. Lord Hellcat

    Lord Hellcat Gold Member Hellcat Car Club Gold Supporting Member HCC UK President HCC Charter Member

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    Honesty is the best policy and I applaud that.
    Whilst my concerns are more about how this car will hang together over time. An exhaust X pipe, a MAF and a Filter make sense. Surely the Hellcat engine running on the lean side cannot be good for long term durability. I'd rather we running a decent AFR
     
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  15. VanishingPoint

    VanishingPoint Silver Member

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    So if it is running lean, how is it that everyone here who has pulled the factory air filter (and there have been a few if I recall) at the track and dyno saw an increase in power without it?
     
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