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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Have been out of track stuff for ~4 years now bc life got in the way. (I used to have a NASA comp license, raced a Thunder Roadster & was one of the first nationally certified NASA track instructors starting back in 2004.) But I'm getting back into it now with just doing DE. I plan on taking my MY20 WB Charger to Roebling Road Raceway in a couple of weeks. From what I've read, the conventional wisdom for brake fluid is Castrol SRF & the OEM Brembo brake pads are good enough.

How much brake fluid am I gonna need to purge/change out the entire system?

If not the OEM pads, what's recommended? (I don't mind having to change the pads at the track.)

TIA for any advice.

(Some of my exploits on my YT Channel throughout the years past.)
 

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2019 Challenger SRT Hellcat Redeye Widebody
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For brake fluid, I bought the 2-pack of Motul RBF600 and that was plenty.


I did one track day on the stock pads and they were down to the metal. During the track day, there were times where I had to take cooldown laps mid-session because the brake pedal was so soft from the squishy pads.

I run PowerStop Track Day pads now and they just finished up their 4th track day before I needed to change them (fronts were done, rears probably had 2-3 more track days in them). I just put new Track Day pads on last weekend. Once the rotors are done, I'll go to PowerStop Track Day rotors, too. I ran the rotor & pad set on my SRT8 last season and they were great.


I'll probably start going to 3 track days on fronts, 6 track days on rear with 6 track days/rotor set just to make sure I don't go too low on the fronts.

A lot of people swear by Hawk pads, but they're pretty pricey, IMO. I'd have to be convinced they're a significant upgrade in longevity for me to switch to them. When I started out, I was chasing the clock a lot - but these days I would rather have track time instead of an extra 0.1s/lap. And if I'm spending lots of money on brake pads, then that's money I'm not spending on track days. :/
 

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Ditto on the fluid. Semi-metallic for sure on the pads. I love the Wagner Perfect Stop semi's. Stop good, last, and keep the rotors clean during street use. I leave them on all the time too.
 

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For your first outing with the car I think you're on the right track. Get some good brake fluid like the Motul or ATE200 and flush out your stock fluid. 1 liter should be plenty.
I wouldn't worry about brake pads yet unless your stock ones have significant wear. I imagine you're just going to get on the track and get your adrenaline up some the first time. Once you want to dive in harder and heat things up more maybe it will be time to consider some higher friction pads. It's a slippery slope though. Then you'll get the Girodisc rotors and high $ brake fluid and good tires . . .
But you know all that. You used to race. How do you make a fortune in racing . . .
 

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2017 Daytona 392
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First time out? Fresh dot4 of your choice and leave the rest alone. Once you get up to pace though...

Since you previous track experience, I'd say hawk 60s or 70s after the brembos are used up. I could overheat the power stop track day pads at vir after about four flying laps: solid pedal but diminished braking force. I don't have that issue with 60s in my sp. If you're a hellcat, 70s.

The factory rotors are "meh", but fine for initial track use. I switched to DBA rings and like them, but the Girodisc ahem Demon Performance parts are even better if you want to spend the coin.
 

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Motul DOT 5.1 for me. New flush & fill every spring. OE pads are great IMO. Plenty of folks selling slightly used ones (for cheap) when replacing with those goofy Z26 pads. So easy to change out, I keep a supply handy & use Stop Tech pads for street.
 

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With your previous experience I'm sure you'll be at 10/10ths and finding the limits of tires and brakes by the end of that first track day! Scat Pack Widebody - so 392, 15.4" 6-pots and stock Pirellis?

Many seem to worship Castrol SRF but I'm not racing for a living. A fluid with boiling points over 600F dry & 400F wet with quick bleeds before & after events and semi-annual flushes are more than adequate. Wilwood, Motul, AP Racing, ATE, Endless, Torque, et cetera. (Usually takes me 1.5 bottles of Wilwood/Motul for flushes.)

Many good track compounds are out there (Hawk DTC & Raybestos ST or Wilwood, PFC, Cobalt, Porterfield, Pagid, Ferodo...) but I went with Carbotech XP12 front & XP10 rear. I chose them because that's what NASA Southeast champion Joel Vandiver used on his Pursuit Charger & green 426 Challenger in the early 2010s.
 
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2020 Challenger Hellraisin Scat Pack.
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Have been out of track stuff for ~4 years now bc life got in the way. (I used to have a NASA comp license, raced a Thunder Roadster & was one of the first nationally certified NASA track instructors starting back in 2004.) But I'm getting back into it now with just doing DE. I plan on taking my MY20 WB Charger to Roebling Road Raceway in a couple of weeks. From what I've read, the conventional wisdom for brake fluid is Castrol SRF & the OEM Brembo brake pads are good enough.

How much brake fluid am I gonna need to purge/change out the entire system?

If not the OEM pads, what's recommended? (I don't mind having to change the pads at the track.)

TIA for any advice.

(Some of my exploits on my YT Channel throughout the years past.)
For track use the factory manual calls for DOT 4 fluid to be used. The removal of the DOT 3 fluid needs to be 100% so the fluid flush/bleed needs to operate the ABS pump to flush out any DOT 3 fluid and replace it with DOT 4 fluid. Not sure how much fluid is required to do this. If you can find a table of fluid capacities -- sometimes this is in the owners manual -- this might tell you.

For brake hardware I'd be inclined to at first stick with the factory hardware.

Just be sure the pads have enough material (at least half or more of what they have when new). If you fit new pads before a track day be sure to give them a bedding in before you use the car and the brakes on the track.

At the track you can then look over other cars like yours to see what brake hardware is being used and get some idea of what you might want to use.

I'd also consider improving air flow to the brakes. There is a limit to how well the brakes will work even with special pads due to heat build up. Better cooling can make a world of difference. Not as easy as just replacing the pads, but the return in terms of better braking can be huge.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks to everyone for their input -- I highly appreciate it. Given the even is 2 weeks away & I needed to make sure I got the parts in time, I've gone with the Power Stop Track Day pads (F/R) & Motul RBF600. (I so wish they'd bring back ATE Blue but I know that's a pipedream.) I should be getting it all next week.

Also, the car I'm driving is a MY20 WB HC Charger with the OEM Pirelli AS high performance tires. Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

I'll report back after the event.

Again, thanks for everyone's input!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Didn't do the NASA-SE track event but went there yesterday for the SCCA Track Nights event. Ran in Advanced Group. Most of the drivers running in Advanced had heavily modified vehicles &/or (non-DOT) race rubber. Other than the aforementioned brake pads & brake fluid changes, I ran a complete OEM set-up.

Here's a video of the last session & description.

Got lots of brake fade from the Power Stop Track Day pads. 🤬

Granted CMP is very hard on brakes. But if I track her again, I plan on getting better brake pads.

Thanks to everyone for their assistance!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The factory brakes and power will overwhelm the tires anyways.
Managing the tires was fine & not that difficult. I was constantly having the anti-lock system kick in under heavy braking and with repeated application, the pads would fade. So, I would have to adjust where I applied braking when approaching certain corners knowing the brakes had heated up with prior turns. That was the tricky part & you can see from the vid that I misjudged a few times & overshot the turn-in. I was also utilizing some serious trail braking to get the car to rotate on some of the tighter corners.
 

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Have been out of track stuff for ~4 years now bc life got in the way. (I used to have a NASA comp license, raced a Thunder Roadster & was one of the first nationally certified NASA track instructors starting back in 2004.) But I'm getting back into it now with just doing DE. I plan on taking my MY20 WB Charger to Roebling Road Raceway in a couple of weeks. From what I've read, the conventional wisdom for brake fluid is Castrol SRF & the OEM Brembo brake pads are good enough.

How much brake fluid am I gonna need to purge/change out the entire system?

If not the OEM pads, what's recommended? (I don't mind having to change the pads at the track.)

TIA for any advice.

(Some of my exploits on my YT Channel throughout the years past.)
On a somewhat related note "Bob Bondurant on High Performance Driving" is a great book, 'r whatever it's called.
 

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Pad fade? Called it. Hawk 80/70 for you!
 
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