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@Xylander I know I read that post you just copied and pasted when you originally posted that a month or so ago. You’re not going to get points on your license for cats. You’re going to get a fine.
Now, here's where you're wrong. I was an administrator at FDLE (FL Dept. of Law Enforcement) HQ here in Tallahassee for 5 years. I specifically worked in the regulatory and liaison section of the Criminal Justice Information Service. My entire position was working with the EPA, FBI, and the numerous LE organizations in the state to establish, enforce, and improve inter-agency operations specifically in the arena of vehicular and traffic law enforcement.

It's a class 2 misdemeanor to knowingly ask for and remove the catalytic converters in the state of Florida. Not only is it a crime that goes on your permanent record, it also comes with added Federal fines for both the owner of the vehicle and the person or shop who removed them. The fine is variable per a judge's discretion, but it ranges from $1,500 to $3,000 per catalytic converter tampered with. So, on a Hellcat, that would up to a $6,000 fine, an offense you can be arrested for, car impounded, and if you've ever seen the main impound lot in the Capital, trust me, you don't want your car in that lot. The law here, written in 2011, outlines improper catalytic converter use as a standard non-moving violation. This is primarily used for broken or failed catalytic converters, etc. In section 5 of the law, it specifically states that willingly seeking out and removing the catalytic converters is a class 2 misdemeanor offense. It's also a class 2 misdemeanor to knowingly buy, sell, or trade a vehicle with the cats removed... unless you're a dealer, then it's a class 1 misdemeanor. At the state level, it's also at least a misdemeanor for a shop to perform that work, and it can become a felony if repeated. As I mentioned, there's also Federal laws and EPA regulations that can also be brought... but you really only see this being levied against businesses and not individuals. Fun fact, we've trained the tax collector inspectors responsible for VIN verification at initial registration to examine the vehicle for tampering to the emissions systems. If you try and register such a vehicle, you can be detained and arrested on the spot. It all depends on if you get someone who bothers with actually doing it... which with government workers... that's going to be rare.

While I was there, I was the liaison after Biden took office and instructed the EPA to crack down on the Clean Air Act. We put over 30 exhaust shops out of business with multi-million dollar fines and impounded close to 1,000 cars in 2020 alone. About a third of the impounded vehicles were identified and impounded via our internet task force who does nothing but watch YouTube and other social media outlets to identify Florida residents doing things like removing the cats, posting videos of street racing (they have an algorithm that searches around the keyword Mexico, FYI), and so on. We literally impounded about 350 cars using internet evidence alone. At one point, we had over 10 Hellcats in the impound for cat violations.
 

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Sure, but what they cost now is insane.

Notice how they mentioned the finishing order aligned with the price? Most expensive car was the fastest. Least expensive car was the slowest. As should be expected. Point of this being, despite Xanders verbose missives, the C8 does get beat by some other cars. Maybe not other front engine RWD cars, but the fact that the NSX walked away from it, also being mid-engine, shows the advantages of both instant electric torque and AWD. A C8 traps @ 122 in the quarter mile, so while it may hang with McLarens for the first few hundred feet, 720's trap 20 mph faster and a 765 almost 30 mph faster. Granted, completely different category of car.
I agree 1000%!
On the street, no one is racing to 140mph. That being said, there are quicker versions of the C8 coming soon, we're talking about a BASE model C8 Stingray here. The C7 Z06, C7 ZR1 or the ZL1 will all outperform the C8 Stingray from a roll. The C8 Z06, C8 ZR1 or Zora is going to compete with cars well over twice the price. Don't get me wrong, if you like to drag race at the track, with a drag pack, on a prepped surface, the Hellcat is a great car to do it with. The majority of owners aren't doing that though and on the street, they struggle badly at low speeds.
Don't forget about the upcoming E-Ray Stingray C8 too!
 

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Now, here's where you're wrong. I was an administrator at FDLE (FL Dept. of Law Enforcement) HQ here in Tallahassee for 5 years. I specifically worked in the regulatory and liaison section of the Criminal Justice Information Service. My entire position was working with the EPA, FBI, and the numerous LE organizations in the state to establish, enforce, and improve inter-agency operations specifically in the arena of vehicular and traffic law enforcement.

It's a class 2 misdemeanor to knowingly ask for and remove the catalytic converters in the state of Florida. Not only is it a crime that goes on your permanent record, it also comes with added Federal fines for both the owner of the vehicle and the person or shop who removed them. The fine is variable per a judge's discretion, but it ranges from $1,500 to $3,000 per catalytic converter tampered with. So, on a Hellcat, that would up to a $6,000 fine, an offense you can be arrested for, car impounded, and if you've ever seen the main impound lot in the Capital, trust me, you don't want your car in that lot. The law here, written in 2011, outlines improper catalytic converter use as a standard non-moving violation. This is primarily used for broken or failed catalytic converters, etc. In section 5 of the law, it specifically states that willingly seeking out and removing the catalytic converters is a class 2 misdemeanor offense. It's also a class 2 misdemeanor to knowingly buy, sell, or trade a vehicle with the cats removed... unless you're a dealer, then it's a class 1 misdemeanor. At the state level, it's also at least a misdemeanor for a shop to perform that work, and it can become a felony if repeated. As I mentioned, there's also Federal laws and EPA regulations that can also be brought... but you really only see this being levied against businesses and not individuals. Fun fact, we've trained the tax collector inspectors responsible for VIN verification at initial registration to examine the vehicle for tampering to the emissions systems. If you try and register such a vehicle, you can be detained and arrested on the spot. It all depends on if you get someone who bothers with actually doing it... which with government workers... that's going to be rare.

While I was there, I was the liaison after Biden took office and instructed the EPA to crack down on the Clean Air Act. We put over 30 exhaust shops out of business with multi-million dollar fines and impounded close to 1,000 cars in 2020 alone. About a third of the impounded vehicles were identified and impounded via our internet task force who does nothing but watch YouTube and other social media outlets to identify Florida residents doing things like removing the cats, posting videos of street racing (they have an algorithm that searches around the keyword Mexico, FYI), and so on. We literally impounded about 350 cars using internet evidence alone. At one point, we had over 10 Hellcats in the impound for cat violations.
Cops do the same for street racing I assume 🧐
 

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Real world experience not Internet.
I go from Demon to ZL1.
The ZL1 is a super car. The 10 speed transmission is far superior to the dated 8 speed in the Demon. The light weight and the wheel base is a huge difference over the dated Challenger platform. These cars run 10.50s all day with drag radials. The Demon will run a 10 flat high 9.99 with 1 seat and-no rear seats. A 100 lb driver with slicks in good weather.
On average they run 10.50s. I seen it first hand at Legion of Demons. So all the keyword wizards can put that to rest those are the facts
 
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Even though anything with a Camaro nameplate post 2002 is third world ugly IMO, I would own a 16+ ZL1 if it was as comfortable to drive as a Hellcat and I didn't have to break my back to get in one. I have no interest in corner carving or lateral G-forces, it would just be cool to say I own a ZL1 (plus the PDR is a cool piece of tech). The trunk space and rear seat space don't bother me either. It's just a fact that the Camaros and Mustangs don't glide down the road as nice and comfortable as a Challenger.
 

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A Van Down by the River
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Even though anything with a Camaro nameplate post 2002 is third world ugly IMO, I would own a 16+ ZL1 if it was as comfortable to drive as a Hellcat and I didn't have to break my back to get in one. I have no interest in corner carving or lateral G-forces, it would just be cool to say I own a ZL1 (plus the PDR is a cool piece of tech). The trunk space and rear seat space don't bother me either. It's just a fact that the Camaros and Mustangs don't glide down the road as nice and comfortable as a Challenger.
Having owned several 3rd Gen's, I agree that they were very good looking in their day, I still miss my 1991 Z28 but other than that, the interior quality wasn't great, lots of hard plastic and pieces that break. I owned two 4th Gen's, interior was a mild step up but still lots of plastic, however I didn't like the exterior as much as the 3rd Gen and HATED the engine being under the cowl and very inaccessible. The 5th Gen Camaro is hideous to me other than the ZL1 but I wouldn't even own one of those either because the interior in the 5th Gen looks like crap, the retro look ended up making it just look really outdated, and that's not even talking about the inferior chassis and lack of power. The 6th Gen Camaro is meh except for the ZL1. The ZL1 does everything right, exterior, interior, but you're correct, the ride quality is stiffer than a Challenger/Charger.
 

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Opinions obviously vary. I wouldn't even consider a 5th Gen Camaro. They are hideous to me and the interior quality is absolutely garbage. They were built on an outdated chassis which made them heavy and they were underpowered for their weight. The 6th Gen ZL1 knocked it out of the park. Nothing about the widebody Charger or Challenger appeals to me at all and I've said that ever since they were released. I'm just not a fan of the Fast and Furious look. Its all good though, to each their own.
The Z/28 is bad ass.
About the only 5th gen Camaro I would want.
 

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Cops do the same for street racing I assume 🧐
Heck, when I was out and about in the street racing scene (Many years ago), the Cops were some of the ones out there racing while off duty (quite a few liked to watch the races too and even bet on them). It was actually pretty Cool because I could concentrate on the race and not worry about getting arrested by the Police!

Heck, I even saw a LEO want to race someone in their squad car. Things had gotten heated between the LEO and someone on another racer's crew but the Officer's partner calmed him down and cooler heads prevailed! The Cop would've lost that race but I thought that we were all going to jail! :D

As dangerous as street racing is, it sure was fun (and most of the time, pretty profitable until you factor in the cost to keep a fast car fast)! Having gotten older (and Hopefully a little wiser), I wouldn't do it now because the risk isn't worth the reward!
 

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I had a 2015 SS 1LE. It was an amazing car! I ran 1:50’s at Sonoma bone stock with some 888 tires! Just a bad ass car. The Z28 is just awesome with its 427 and carbon ceramics. The Gen 5 chassis came from Holden and was actually really good. It was developed Australia. It has a 5 star crash rating, and is awesome on the race track.
Car Tire Sky Wheel Land vehicle
Car Land vehicle Vehicle Tire Wheel
Wheel Tire Car Jeans Trousers
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Car Vehicle Tire Land vehicle Wheel
 
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I had a 2015 SS 1LE. It was an amazing car! I ran 1:50’s at Sonoma bone stock with some 888 tires! Just a bad ass car. The Z28 is just awesome with its 427 and carbon ceramics. The Gen 5 chassis came from Holden and was actually really good. It was developed Australia. It has a 5 star crash rating, and is awesome on the race track. View attachment 594556 View attachment 594557 View attachment 594558 View attachment 594559 View attachment 594560
And even the track built 5th Gen Z28 can't even come close to a 6th Gen ZL1 on a track. The 6th Gen chassis is FAR superior.
 
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And even the track built 5th Gen Z28 can't even come close to a 6th Gen ZL1 on a track. The 6th Gen chassis is FAR superior.
Yes, your baby is safe. Gen 6 is a Cadillac chassis developed on the track. It’s brilliant! I like it better than the C7 on the track. However you knocked the gen 5 and I needed to defend it. It’s a great car and is very capable on the track. I destroyed at every event I ever entered with it. From autocross, bracket racing, and Time attack. It may not look good to you, but it is no slouch. Now the gen 4 was a wet noodle.…….
 

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Yes, your baby is safe. Gen 6 is a Cadillac chassis developed on the track. It’s brilliant! I like it better than the C7 on the track. However you knocked the gen 5 and I needed to defend it. It’s a great car and is very capable on the track. I destroyed at every event I ever entered with it. From autocross, bracket racing, and Time attack. It may not look good to you, but it is no slouch. Now the gen 4 was a wet noodle.…….
The 5th Gen just isn't as good as the 6th Gen in every way, its not just my opinion, is a fact backed up by every professional driver that has driven one. That was my point. If you liked the 5th Gen Camaro that much, I was simply pointing out that the 6th Gen is considerably better. And yes, the Blackwing is amazing too.
 

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So many hellcat haters on a hellcat forum lol. The only thing I like about GM’s is they have way better tuning support from HPT. You can modify the PCM OS with that from one that has the code for a physical GM flex fuel sensor. But of course I’m not talking about anything 2020+
 

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The 5th Gen just isn't as good as the 6th Gen in every way, its not just my opinion, is a fact backed up by every professional driver that has driven one. That was my point. If you liked the 5th Gen Camaro that much, I was simply pointing out that the 6th Gen is considerably better. And yes, the Blackwing is amazing too.
Haha you love an argument it seems. i find it’s hard to agree with you 🤣 No one has said the 5th is as good, especially me. Usually things get better with newer models. Usually…..
 

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So many hellcat haters on a hellcat forum lol. The only thing I like about GM’s is they have way better tuning support from HPT. You can modify the PCM OS with that from one that has the code for a physical GM flex fuel sensor. But of course I’m not talking about anything 2020+
Whats wrong with 2020+? They have the same ECM tuning except the C8 and Blackwing.
 
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