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hey guys,

Like a lot of us owners, I leased a HellCat as I really couldn't afford to buy it at the time.
I did the same thing with my 07 SRT8 Jeep, which I bought and still have 191k miles strong.

I want to buy the Hell Cat out when my March 2020 lease is up.
….because I don't think, I can re-lease one, or the dealer may give me a hard time because car "was" slightly modded.

Here are my main questions from (hopefully) some people that have done this and gotten a good deal.

1) I can buy this thing out at $45k price …. from original terms...and 36k mile 3 yr term usage.
IS that price negotiable at all? AS these things have taken a beating in the past 3 years. Value-Wise.
. . . .and I only have 22k miles on it. (when lease is up)

2) The car will have had a tune... etc.... but all will be removed and back to stock.
What could happen when I turn it in....as to lease another vehicle?

3) Will Chrysler/Dodge make me a better deal to keep it and buy it out?
my credit is NOT as high as I would like, as I am extended pretty good with credit cards etc.

4) If I re-lease something...and get deal done.... Can Chrysler/Dodge come back on me with the leased car being modified?


Anybody got any helpful hints.... or tips or tricks to get the best deal?

….I never feel truly good about any car deal....as I traded in a car and put $7700 down on this lease...
….and got payments to about $600 even ….. then later I found out (within a month) that others were putting like
$2500-$3k down and got the same or better deal. Meaning most stealerships will screw their own grandmother to make a dollar.
that coupled with the fact that Demons, and RedEyes and newer versions cheaper have really dinged us 2015-2017 HC owners
on our used values, trade ins etc. Terrible.

Please advise, and thanks in advance for any help.
--chuck in slower/lower Delaware.
 

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1- If $45k is your residual value than that is the price you will pay, they won't negotiate with you.
2- If you remove the tune you will be fine, remove any other mods so you can sell then. Put it back to stock as much as you can.
3-They will not make you a better deal.
Your credit isn't as good and you have a higher debt to income ratio, so if you don't think you can lease another then how do you plan to purchase it?

Remember, if you buy your vehicle after the lease is up for $45K you will have to pay taxes and other state fees (tax, title, license, etc) on the purchase price of $45K

One last thing, Don't blame the Dealership for presenting you with numbers (your trade plus $7700) to get you the payment you wanted because you agreed to it without doing your due diligence (research)

Good Luck
 

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2) The car will have had a tune... etc.... but all will be removed and back to stock.
What could happen when I turn it in....
does your lease terms & agreement indicate that perf mods, such as a tune, are ok? I kinda doubt it.
a tune will ALWAYS throw the P1400 code into the BCM, removing the tuned pcm &/or returning to stock does not remove the embedded code. I assure you the dealership service dept will scan for it 1st thing when they perform the turn in inspection.
what happens next at the dealership wont be up to you, whether you can afford it or not...
 

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I wouldn't loose sleep over it...If you choose to turn it in for another one of their cars, lease or buy, and the cars exterior is in great condition, the dealer will just dump it to another buyer ASAP...most dealers don't care about mods left on the car, as long as the engine runs with no suspecting noises you're golden! we must not forget those three choice words they put in print on the window of used cars "SOLD AS IS"
 

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does your lease terms & agreement indicate that perf mods, such as a tune, are ok? I kinda doubt it.
a tune will ALWAYS throw the P1400 code into the BCM, removing the tuned pcm &/or returning to stock does not remove the embedded code. I assure you the dealership service dept will scan for it 1st thing when they perform the turn in inspection.
what happens next at the dealership wont be up to you, whether you can afford it or not...
lol have you ever done a turn in? don't spew off false information. On a lease turn in they hardly scan the ecu. Most of the time these cars get inspected by a 3rd party company who submits the report to Chrysler cap (they are looking for curb rash, dents, dings, scratches, and windshield chips, and on the inside they look for stains, stuff not working, etc etc) dealership you turn the car into is offered first crack at buying and if they don't want it then it's off to wholesale auctions i.e mannheim.
 

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RULE #1 when you lease-you never put a DOWNPAYMENT, ever
As to your other dilemas-best thing would be to get a cheaper lease as you stated you had CC debt (start paying off or it will keep climbing), to avoid the disposition fee maybe re-lease another Chrysler/Dodge Vehicle as they will usually waive if you re-lease.
Check the used car prices on your HC and see if $45K corresponds to the market...based on your info your car was MSRP at roughly $72000-$74000 you paid about $29000 in 36 months (I would still lease another instead of buying) now-you could've bought a brand new Honda or any other midsize car in that price range and still have some equity left when sold...simmer on that unless you HAVE TO HAVE a Hellcat, cause we know you don't NEED one ;)
I thought about purchasing mine at lease end-but figured that it would be like paying MSRP for it when you add your lease payments plus purchase...doesn't make sense, plus I came to a conclusion that I don't really want a HC anymore so will probably continue leasing something cheaper...

In order to get the best APR you need to be 700 or above for credit score-they also look at debt to income ratio, they would probably approve you it's just not gonna be the best rates etc (maybe get a credit union as a back up option)

Chrysler will not come back at you once they sign off that vehicle has been received in good standing

You still have the SRT8 so why not get into something more financially accurate for your needs like a $250 or less/mo lease (Chevy and GMC has great low lease deals) and pay off your CC debt and remember NO DOWN PAYMENT on lease, except the due at signing which usually covers the first month and fees, license and registration

Great info on leasing at www.leasehackr.com
 

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Wow man it sounds like that dealer got you pretty good, I leased mine as well but I only put down 2k and my payment is 520. My lease is up in april and my buyout Is 42k with the buyout fee which is 350.00. Your car has low miles so I would list it for sale and see if you can get any money back out of it. Your car should be worth 48k or so with those miles, I just listed mine for 50k out here in Hawaii because hellcats still have a 15k mark up out here and the cheapest used hellcat out here is 58k right now. If mine sells I'm going back to the mainland to pick up a new widebody car more than likely. Beat of luck!
 

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Need assistance. Hello!
not sure if anyone Has had this issue, but I had thought about buying my hellcat At the end of the lease. The dealership actually made me an offer to buy it and then retracted it saying the car is a special item and Chrysler capital does not allow these cars to be sold in that way. Anyone else have this experience?
 

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In today's market, I've heard some horror stories as of late. Remember, as a leasee, you don't own the car. Chrysler Corporation does. You can elect to buy it, but they can also elect to not sell it to you. Example:

Good friend of mine had a 2018 Hellcat Challenger on lease. His residual was around 39k. It was bone stock, 14k miles. He planned on buying it last month and had the means to make it happen. When he got there, the dealership told him that Chrysler wanted the car back and were not planning to honor a buy back. They told him to remove any personalized equipment from the car and to plan on turning it in. When he pressed them on it, they told him that the car was worth far more than the residual and they wanted to resell it. The dealership gave him a buyout price of $47,000. He declined.

They took the car and It sold for nearly 60k. In short, they made a total of 110k on an 81k car. It was also a PCP M6. I told my buddy that yeah, it was real shady what they were doing to him... but they were really only marking him up 6-7k over his expected residual. In today's climate, whomever bought that 59k PCP M6 got a screaming hot deal.
 

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As for turning in a lease with a P1400 code... yeeesh, I dunno. If they don't check and or simply turn a blind eye at turn in, you're golden. But, provisions do exist for them to force you to buy it out or sue you for the value lost in the car. Whether they will do that or not is anyone's guess. Normally you see dealers exercising that right when someone turns in what was supposed to be a white car, and it's been cheaply repainted some non-standard color, or if the modifications made to the car are similarly outlandish.

Me personally, I will never deal in, buy, or trade a Hellcat with a P1400 code. There's lots of people like me. If I were a dealer, I'd be making you buy it. I used to be a new car manager back in the early 2000s and I have a lot of experience with Mustang people trying to get out of their leased cars with all sorts of nonsense mods that I couldn't flip.
 

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Need assistance. Hello!
not sure if anyone Has had this issue, but I had thought about buying my hellcat At the end of the lease. The dealership actually made me an offer to buy it and then retracted it saying the car is a special item and Chrysler capital does not allow these cars to be sold in that way. Anyone else have this experience?
Did you contact chrysler capital? There is no such clause as special item and chrysler cap doesn't care if people to sell their cars to cdjr dealership or buy it out from them as long as ccap is made whole.

My best advice check if chrysler cap allows 3rd party sales, then check carmax, vroom, carvana. I would also suggest find local dealers with similar year and mileage hellcats that are selling them very high, they are more likely to offer you more money for your car than more realistic dealerships.

I think you will find carmax and other 3rd party dealers may. give you more money than cdjr dealers.

Your first call should be to chrysler capital.
 

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In today's market, I've heard some horror stories as of late. Remember, as a leasee, you don't own the car. Chrysler Corporation does.
You don't own the car either when financing. The bank does.

Leasing is great for those planning on getting another car in 3-4 years. With financing you could be upside down significantly, where as leasing you'd simply start fresh.
 

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You don't own the car either when financing. The bank does.

Leasing is great for those planning on getting another car in 3-4 years. With financing you could be upside down significantly, where as leasing you'd simply start fresh.
Technically speaking, incorrect. When you buy a car, yes, the bank holds the title until payment is complete, but legally, the usage and ownership rights are extended to the buyer. A lease is not. The owner of the vehicle is the vehicle manufacturer/their respective financial company. They dictate how their property can be used, and in what capacity with terms detailing fees and penalties for returning their property in a condition less than what the lease agreement allows. In short, it's a long-term rental agreement with the option to purchase.

Thus, a car buyer can legally modify their car, strip it and paint it fuscia, let the dog crap in the back seat... whatever. So long as they keep making payments. If they don't and it gets repo'd, then they have to settle up with their lender after the car is sold. If it sells for a fraction of the value due to poor upkeep, then that person will be sued for the remainder of the loan value.

A lease is different in that the lessee never had ownership rights of the vehicle to begin with. Same scenario, a person goes far beyond bolt-ons and repaints the car and performs a horde of cosmetic and mechanical modifications that substantially lowers the resale potential of the vehicle. There are provisions in the agreement that can force a lesee to purchase the vehicle or be subject to penalties (basically, payments to equal bringing the car back to its expected turn-in state). Turning in a Hellcat lease with a P1400 code can result in this. Captives can even tell you where you can/can't drive the vehicle and for what purpose. Some lease agreements don't allow commercial use. Or, if they do, it's a different type of lease contract.

If someone returns a 2016 PCP Hellcat M6 with 4,100mi on it and about $33,000 of residual remaining, fealerships may very well try to prevent the lessee from purchasing the vehicle, as they could very well get $60,000 or more on a resale. This is where buying and leasing greatly differ. A lease ends on its termination date. The overwhelming majority of the time, folks can elect to buy it, swap it for a new model, or walk away. However, in recent history especially, some dealerships are refusing to allow lessees to purchase the car via stall tactics, and other means to try and discourage a buyout. You really only see this on high value, high demand cars and trucks right now. In the past, you leased, and the car followed a well-known trend on its expected used value. Right now, some cars like Hellcats are rising in cost on the used market and there's a lot of meat on the resell bone.


EDIT: Edited out an incorrect statement.
 

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Technically speaking, incorrect. When you buy a car, yes, the bank holds the title until payment is complete, but legally, the usage and ownership rights are extended to the buyer. A lease is not. The owner of the vehicle is the vehicle manufacturer/their respective financial company. They dictate how their property can be used, and in what capacity with terms detailing fees and penalties for returning their property in a condition less than what the lease agreement allows. In short, it's a long-term rental agreement with the option to purchase.

Thus, a car buyer can legally modify their car, strip it and paint it fuscia, let the dog crap in the back seat... whatever. So long as they keep making payments. If they don't and it gets repo'd, then they have to settle up with their lender after the car is sold. If it sells for a fraction of the value due to poor upkeep, then that person will be sued for the remainder of the loan value.

A lease is different in that the lessee never had ownership rights of the vehicle to begin with. Same scenario, a person goes far beyond bolt-ons and repaints the car and performs a horde of cosmetic and mechanical modifications that substantially lowers the resale potential of the vehicle. There are provisions in the agreement that can force a lesee to purchase the vehicle or be subject to penalties (basically, payments to equal bringing the car back to its expected turn-in state). Turning in a Hellcat lease with a P1400 code can result in this.

In rare cases, lessors can elect to not sell the car to the lessee. If someone returns a 2016 PCP Hellcat M6 with 4,100mi on it and about $33,000 of residual remaining, they may very well try to prevent the lessee from purchasing the vehicle, as they could very well get $60,000 or more on a resale. This is where buying and leasing greatly differ. Under no circumstance, assuming a buyer satisfies all parts of their lending agreement with the bank, can their car be taken from them. A lease ends on its termination date. The overwhelming majority of the time, folks can elect to buy it, swap it for a new model, or walk away. However, in recent history especially, some dealerships are refusing to allow lessees to purchase the car. You really only see this on high value, high demand cars and trucks right now. In the past, you leased, and the car followed a well-known trend on its expected used value. Right now, some cars like Hellcats are rising in cost on the used market. Thus, it's entirely plausible that if you leased a 2018 for 3 years, that you may be presented with a high buyout rate that reflects what they expect to get out of it on a used sale, minus what you've put into it.
"A lease is different in that the lessee never had ownership rights of the vehicle to begin with"

This would be completely and utterly false, you sign a contract agreeing upon a final residual and you have first rights to buy the car before anyone, furthermore a captive cannot deny you the right to purchase cars.

I have dealt with almost every captive and read their contracts, no where in the contract does it say Chrysler capital can refuse to sell the car to you.

The only reason this could ever happen is if your credit went to shit and no bank or financial institution will give you a loan for the residual value of the car but in that case you cannot get a loan for any financing to begin with. Again highly unlikely.

As far as modifying the car goes it depends on your intentions, if you lease it and plan on buying it out at end you can certainly modify it, you can turn it in at your own risk but be warned that if anything goes wrong in the inspection you will get charged for any and all modifications which could result in a lot of charges.

In rare cases, lessors can elect to not sell the car to the lessee. If someone returns a 2016 PCP Hellcat M6 with 4,100mi on it and about $33,000 of residual remaining, they may very well try to prevent the lessee from purchasing the vehicle, as they could very well get $60,000 or more on a resale.
Again this is bad, bad information and utterly incorrect and misleading. You are probably confusing 3rd party buyouts with actually buying the car and selling it yourself.

3rd party buyouts occur when a 3rd party like carmax, ford dealer, etc etc offer you say $60,000 for your hellcat with a residual of $33,000 as per your example.

Ally will offer 3rd party buyouts at a higher price than they would offer you the original leasee the buyout, so in this example ally bank says 60k is the buyout for carmax

Chrysler capital in the past allowed 3rd party buyouts and the original leasee's payoff was the buyout, so carmax can buy out the car for 33k

Currently almost every manufacturer has stopped 3rd party buyouts, so in this example Chrysler capital will not allow anyone but you the original leasee to buyout the car or you can turn it in, now there is some tax circumvention if you use a 3rd party dealer. So when you buy out the car normally you pay taxes and then sell it, so $33,000 + tax but if somehow like carmax, vroom, carvana, local dealer, etc etc buys it then you skip the tax.

Hope that clears things up, a lot of what you are saying about modifying leased cars is completely correct, turning in a leased car with modifications is playing with fire.

However leasing and financing aren't as different as most think, and the contracts on a lease in the past would much rather push people to buy the car because they were selling for way below residual value.
 

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"A lease is different in that the lessee never had ownership rights of the vehicle to begin with"

This would be completely and utterly false, you sign a contract agreeing upon a final residual and you have first rights to buy the car before anyone, furthermore a captive cannot deny you the right to purchase cars.

I have dealt with almost every captive and read their contracts, no where in the contract does it say Chrysler capital can refuse to sell the car to you.

The only reason this could ever happen is if your credit went to shit and no bank or financial institution will give you a loan for the residual value of the car but in that case you cannot get a loan for any financing to begin with. Again highly unlikely.

As far as modifying the car goes it depends on your intentions, if you lease it and plan on buying it out at end you can certainly modify it, you can turn it in at your own risk but be warned that if anything goes wrong in the inspection you will get charged for any and all modifications which could result in a lot of charges.



Again this is bad, bad information and utterly incorrect and misleading. You are probably confusing 3rd party buyouts with actually buying the car and selling it yourself.

3rd party buyouts occur when a 3rd party like carmax, ford dealer, etc etc offer you say $60,000 for your hellcat with a residual of $33,000 as per your example.

Ally will offer 3rd party buyouts at a higher price than they would offer you the original leasee the buyout, so in this example ally bank says 60k is the buyout for carmax

Chrysler capital in the past allowed 3rd party buyouts and the original leasee's payoff was the buyout, so carmax can buy out the car for 33k

Currently almost every manufacturer has stopped 3rd party buyouts, so in this example Chrysler capital will not allow anyone but you the original leasee to buyout the car or you can turn it in, now there is some tax circumvention if you use a 3rd party dealer. So when you buy out the car normally you pay taxes and then sell it, so $33,000 + tax but if somehow like carmax, vroom, carvana, local dealer, etc etc buys it then you skip the tax.

Hope that clears things up, a lot of what you are saying about modifying leased cars is completely correct, turning in a leased car with modifications is playing with fire.

However leasing and financing aren't as different as most think, and the contracts on a lease in the past would much rather push people to buy the car because they were selling for way below residual value.

You're right, I misspoke earlier. I was more aiming at what dealerships are doing to actively discourage lease buy outs. You're correct in that the captive/lessee contract allows for buyout per the terms in the contract. However, what's happening in my neck of the woods is that dealerships are combatively discouraging buy outs. In Florida, we have to go through dealers directly. In many cases, if the car is a desirable car, they'll stall, delay, and high pressure sell you to try and do anything other than buy the lease. That's because for every lease bought, that's around 5-10 grand of lost profit in the current market. On most cars right now, 2018s are valued between 18% and 47% higher than their contracted residuals at turn-in. It's also why Carvana, CarMax, and Vroom are making an absolute killing right now on 3rd party buy-outs (for those they can still do it with). But yes, you can buy out your car if you want to... although, IMO, it's kind of dumb right now to do that. Especially considering the below.

One of the more common tactics dealers are doing right now is greatly discouraging lease buy outs by heavily incentivizing new leases. That's because most excellent condition lease turn-ins are worth many thousands more than their contract residuals. Even cars that aren't pristine are gamed. I'll explain:

You turn in a 2018 Hellcat off lease. Maybe it has some curb rash on the wheels, and a cracked front splitter. You want to buy it. Instead, what some dealers are doing is saying, "Hey, if you turn it in, we'll waive all the penalties for the damage, waive processing fees and order you a new Redeye however you like it." They'll come up with a very generous offer to get you either in a new lease for not too much more than you were paying before, or at least get it heavily underneath the MSRP with added perks like 90 days no payments if purchasing, low interest rate, etc. Then, they'll take that lease turn-in, spend a few hundred to a couple of thousand for repairs, then flip it for 15 grand more than they were going to get otherwise. If all goes well, they'll also get a new sale or lease and everyone wins.
There's nothing wrong with doing this, but that's how many lease turn-ins are going right now. In fact, if you have a desirable lease, it's a huge bargaining chip for getting a great deal on something else.
 

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Technically speaking, incorrect. When you buy a car, yes, the bank holds the title until payment is complete, but legally, the usage and ownership rights are extended to the buyer. A lease is not. The owner of the vehicle is the vehicle manufacturer/their respective financial company. They dictate how their property can be used, and in what capacity with terms detailing fees and penalties for returning their property in a condition less than what the lease agreement allows. In short, it's a long-term rental agreement with the option to purchase.

Thus, a car buyer can legally modify their car, strip it and paint it fuscia, let the dog crap in the back seat... whatever. So long as they keep making payments. If they don't and it gets repo'd, then they have to settle up with their lender after the car is sold. If it sells for a fraction of the value due to poor upkeep, then that person will be sued for the remainder of the loan value.

A lease is different in that the lessee never had ownership rights of the vehicle to begin with. Same scenario, a person goes far beyond bolt-ons and repaints the car and performs a horde of cosmetic and mechanical modifications that substantially lowers the resale potential of the vehicle. There are provisions in the agreement that can force a lesee to purchase the vehicle or be subject to penalties (basically, payments to equal bringing the car back to its expected turn-in state). Turning in a Hellcat lease with a P1400 code can result in this.

In rare cases, lessors can elect to not sell the car to the lessee. If someone returns a 2016 PCP Hellcat M6 with 4,100mi on it and about $33,000 of residual remaining, they may very well try to prevent the lessee from purchasing the vehicle, as they could very well get $60,000 or more on a resale. This is where buying and leasing greatly differ. Under no circumstance, assuming a buyer satisfies all parts of their lending agreement with the bank, can their car be taken from them. A lease ends on its termination date. The overwhelming majority of the time, folks can elect to buy it, swap it for a new model, or walk away. However, in recent history especially, some dealerships are refusing to allow lessees to purchase the car. You really only see this on high value, high demand cars and trucks right now. In the past, you leased, and the car followed a well-known trend on its expected used value. Right now, some cars like Hellcats are rising in cost on the used market. Thus, it's entirely plausible that if you leased a 2018 for 3 years, that you may be presented with a high buyout rate that reflects what they expect to get out of it on a used sale, minus what you've put into it.
That’s about it in a nutshell, good read “X”
 

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You're right, I misspoke earlier. I was more aiming at what dealerships are doing to actively discourage lease buy outs. You're correct in that the captive/lessee contract allows for buyout per the terms in the contract. However, what's happening in my neck of the woods is that dealerships are combatively discouraging buy outs. In Florida, we have to go through dealers directly. In many cases, if the car is a desirable car, they'll stall, delay, and high pressure sell you to try and do anything other than buy the lease. That's because for every lease bought, that's around 5-10 grand of lost profit in the current market. On most cars right now, 2018s are valued between 18% and 47% higher than their contracted residuals at turn-in. It's also why Carvana, CarMax, and Vroom are making an absolute killing right now on 3rd party buy-outs (for those they can still do it with). But yes, you can buy out your car if you want to... although, IMO, it's kind of dumb right now to do that. Especially considering the below.

One of the more common tactics dealers are doing right now is greatly discouraging lease buy outs by heavily incentivizing new leases. That's because most excellent condition lease turn-ins are worth many thousands more than their contract residuals. Even cars that aren't pristine are gamed. I'll explain:

You turn in a 2018 Hellcat off lease. Maybe it has some curb rash on the wheels, and a cracked front splitter. You want to buy it. Instead, what some dealers are doing is saying, "Hey, if you turn it in, we'll waive all the penalties for the damage, waive processing fees and order you a new Redeye however you like it." They'll come up with a very generous offer to get you either in a new lease for not too much more than you were paying before, or at least get it heavily underneath the MSRP with added perks like 90 days no payments if purchasing, low interest rate, etc. Then, they'll take that lease turn-in, spend a few hundred to a couple of thousand for repairs, then flip it for 15 grand more than they were going to get otherwise. If all goes well, they'll also get a new sale or lease and everyone wins.
There's nothing wrong with doing this, but that's how many lease turn-ins are going right now. In fact, if you have a desirable lease, it's a huge bargaining chip for getting a great deal on something else.
Oh you are a florida guy, My bad, in that case spot on with the above post. Florida is a dumb state where you have to go through the dealer for lease buyouts. That's one reason I pity florida leasers.

Another thing I might add is that they are tacking on unnecessary fees when you buy out to pressure you to avoid buying out.

Yes you hit the nail on the head, spend a few grand and flip it for 15k.

However the new cars are leasing like crap. The residuals took a 5% hit and more... (haven't seen the new numbers)

Dealers are definitely trying to get somebody in the same car for near the same money but it's still higher because of the residual hit and chip shortage.
 
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