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I know a chemist who helped develop hy-per lube zinc replacement additive.
 

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Make sure to use a complete product with Zinc or just an additive with regular oil. Sometimes too much or too less is ineffective. Also, look into hexagonal nano boron additives...interesting research.
 

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On a regular car I had 2 UOAs that pointed to lower wear using a hexagonal boron oil additive...but not enough data to truthfully say it worked for sure to be honest. Try and test to see.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Torco Zep Zinc claims to replace the amount of zinc engineered out of oils in the wake of catalytic converters. I'm looking at Rev-X now and emailed them to see what they're using and how, specifically, it improves performance. If I don't hear back soon, maybe I'll call. Curious what the blend of additives is. No teflon, that I know.
 

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Yeap, Rev-x is one boron based I believe. Archoil 9100 is the one I referenced and used in those UOAs.
 

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Haven't used in Hellcat yet. Want motor to break in first.
 

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I have used an additive in all my vehicles since the day after the oil got crappy on us
 

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Has anyone with a cat delete put a zinc oil additive in their 'Cats, or used an additive like Rev-X Racing oil? Or is that just overkill, do you think?

Summit carries the Rev-X line.
Too much "zinc" (as in ZDDP) can actually lead to increase in wear. The excessive ZDDP forms a glass like coating under heat and pressure and then when this glass coating breaks ups it "plucks" grains of metal from the surface. This can lead to less the optimum surface conditions which leads to a break down of the oil film that would normally exist and prevent metal to metal contact.

IIRC Pennzoil 0w-40 Ultra Platinum has some ZDDP in it along with some moly and phosphous which are anti-wear additives too.

In fact an analysis of this oil found moly at 241 (ppm), phosphorous at 680, and zinc at 821. While the amount of phosphorous and zinc are a bit below "average" moly is above "average".

Link:

Pennzoil Ultra 0w40 / SRT, API SN

Moly ain't bad. My Porche techs recommended the use of Swepco 502 oil improver (which has 200ppm of moly in it -- I had some analyzed) in my Porsche engines. I used some -- two bottles (to "treat" 9+ quarts of oil) -- in both my Porsche engines. I wasn't too concerned about wear but a benefit is the Swepco tended to keep the initial cold start valve clatter down. With my Boxster and about a zillion miles of cam chain or in the case of the Turbo a gear drive from the crank to the lay shaft and from the lay shaft to the cams about a half a zillion miles of chains, 4 cams and 24 valves under very thin alum. covers the engines were a bit noisy at startup. But even at 317K miles and 161K miles neither engine manifested any signs of any engine wear so the factory oil (Mobil 1 0w40 then later Mobil 1 5w-50) was quite up to the task of providing very good lubrication under a variety of operating conditions from 0F to 119F ambient temperature conditions.

I see no need to run excessive amounts of ZDDP even if one doesn't have converters installed.

Just be sure you change the oil at a schedule that takes into account how you use/drive your car. If you race you should expect to show up at the track with fresh oil in the engine.
 

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Zinc/ ZDDP is more important (Critical) for use in flat tappet engines, not so much in our roller tappet engines. Some is still good but not as much as required by a flat tappet engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
Rev-X has a special Zinc additive for flat tappet engines. If I'm remembering correctly, the Penzoil Euro Synthetic had more ZDDP than the ultra platinum, but don't quote me on that. I am curious to know, though, what the additives are in special race oil treatments. For instance, Rev-X Race oil additive notes that it uses "no graphite, moly, teflon, acids."

I have used an additive in all my vehicles since the day after the oil got crappy on us
What do you use, if you don't mind my asking?

I see no need to run excessive amounts of ZDDP even if one doesn't have converters installed.
I don't think anyone sees the need for running *excessive* amounts. I know I don't. Rather, I'm looking to optimize the blend, if possible.
 

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Rev-X has a special Zinc additive for flat tappet engines. If I'm remembering correctly, the Penzoil Euro Synthetic had more ZDDP than the ultra platinum, but don't quote me on that. I am curious to know, though, what the additives are in special race oil treatments. For instance, Rev-X Race oil additive notes that it uses "no graphite, moly, teflon, acids."

What do you use, if you don't mind my asking?

I don't think anyone sees the need for running *excessive* amounts. I know I don't. Rather, I'm looking to optimize the blend, if possible.
Rex-X was nano boron based as discussed above...at least it was years ago.
 

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Yes, fully agree - it is critical for flat tappet cams, not so much for roller cams, and too much additive is not necessarily better for street applications. I use RedLine (also have the Lucas equivalent on the shelf to try in the future), and use only enough per their mixing chart on the website to try and achieve what the good oils had prior to the zinc and moly being severely reduced. This works out to approx. 1/2 bottle for typical street car oil capacity 5-7 qts, and I used a full bottle on my dually Ram CTD that had 11 qts capacity.
 

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Yes, fully agree - it is critical for flat tappet cams, not so much for roller cams, and too much additive is not necessarily better for street applications. I use RedLine (also have the Lucas equivalent on the shelf to try in the future), and use only enough per their mixing chart on the website to try and achieve what the good oils had prior to the zinc and moly being severely reduced. This works out to approx. 1/2 bottle for typical street car oil capacity 5-7 qts, and I used a full bottle on my dually Ram CTD that had 11 qts capacity.
Right, a ton of old cars that had rebuilt engines have lost them due to lack of zinc and phosphorous. I have seen it. It destroys lifters and cam lobes. Don’t waste your time worrying about it for newer vehicles.
 

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Right, a ton of old cars that had rebuilt engines have lost them due to lack of zinc and phosphorous. I have seen it. It destroys lifters and cam lobes. Don’t waste your time worrying about it for newer vehicles.
My info is ZDDP was initially seen as a way to reduce lifter/cam lobe failures which over time proved to be due to not insufficient ZDDP levels but instead lousy cam/lifter metallurgy/quality control.
 

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I must confess I believe the majority of additives are snake oil. However, with that said, I would say two I have run across have some potential merits:

1. Hy-per lube zinc replacement additive. Polymer based and plays nice with Zinc additives. Know a chemist who developed it. Have not used yet, but have some for next oil change in Hellcat.

2. Archoil 9100. Used in my 6.7 Powerstroke Diesel, Onan Diesel generator, and my 2012 Mazda CX-9. Seat of pants makes the engine sound and run a little smoother. CX-9 UOAs did show some lower wear with vs without additive, but honestly not sure if lower engine wear is because of it. Don't have 1,000s of UOAs with or without to prove anything either way.

Just my .02 cents...would start there. Hard to prove these additives work or not. YMMV.
 
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Here is a thing on Jay Leno's garage on Archoil.


For the record, I have no ownership or agenda with these products...just sharing my experiences. Take care all.
 
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I must confess I believe the majority of additives are snake oil. However, with that said, I would say two I have run across have some potential merits:

1. Hy-per lube zinc replacement additive. Polymer based and plays nice with Zinc additives. Know a chemist who developed it. Have not used yet, but have some for next oil change in Hellcat.

2. Archoil 9100. Used in my 6.7 Powerstroke Diesel, Onan Diesel generator, and my 2012 Mazda CX-9. Seat of pants makes the engine sound and run a little smoother. CX-9 UOAs did show some lower wear with vs without additive, but honestly not sure if lower engine wear is because of it. Don't have 1,000s of UOAs with or without to prove anything either way.

Just my .02 cents...would start there. Hard to prove these additives work or not. YMMV.
Pretty sure the owners manual tells you not to use them. Why would you??
 
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