[DGatzby]

Going to take a Redeye up to a straight over 1/2 mile long like that tomorrow. It has stock power and we are going to be careful with fuel/octane and watch temperatures carefully. It will be extremely hot. With my suspension mods/seat time/home track experience we hit that straight it pretty equal speeds with most. I should be able to give you a good comparison. Hope it don’t break.

 

[Jonx96]

let me be clear. We did the full 2.5 mile track with 3 turns at Poconos. We were limited to 100 mph I;he turns and that was the max speed I felt in control anyways. But when I pulled out of the turn to the 3600 ft straight away with a BMW or Mustang next to me, I wanted to smoke them and I could not. It took 2500 feet to go from 95 mph to 170 mph. i barley gained on the stock Charger 392 next to me. But i did toast most other cars even the new Mid engine Vettes

Yes. What I said above will reduce your power significantly. That redeye I was tuning kept saying around 5500 to 6k the car would just fall on its face.

 

[Dennis H]

Need realistic expectations and instruction/experience. Every reason those other cars have track advantage are the same reasons the Hellcat is more streetable. Roomy. Visibility. Etc. I’ll give up the marginal track edge for the room, comfort, and overall Bitchin’ look of my ride.

 

[HP_Addict19]

These cars where designed for drag racing, to go Very Fast in a straight line on a drag strip, and will absolutely smoke any of those cars when used as designed.

If you want a road course Mopar then buy a Viper ACR. It's designed for road course racing and It will Smoke any of those cars, but will loose to the red-eye on the drag strip (unless piloted by a clueless driver)

I agree. The new Challenger and Chargers are muscle cars designed to go fast in a straight line. They’re street cars. I love ‘em.

And they need a lot of mods to race around a track like the first post was doing.

 

[HC5120]

What's fun is seeing how much you can improve. The OP can really improve his times and how the car runs at the track. Like I said above, it's unbelievable what the professional instructors could do with these cars. I am a drag racer, and I don't do the big track stuff, but I spent some days at Bondurant and it was amazing how much there is to learn.

It's always a compromise with this sort of thing unless you want to trailer your car to the track and turn it into a really uncomfortable car to drive on the street. Comfort and performance are almost always inversely proportional.

But I think the Hellcat is amazing for all the things it can do, and you can still load up the family or friends in it, etc.

DennisH is right on the money.

 

[HP_Addict19]

I was just tuning a redeye that was stock besides my tune. Well before the tuning process I asked for a completely stock log. He was going into cat over temp right away and the injector pulse width was going high enough it was pulling power from the car. I can about guarantee this is your issue.
At the end he picked up good power by just fixing that issue.

This is interesting. I heard about another car, ‘21 Charger HC that had the same problem. The “going into cat over temp”

 

[Barbell_Cat_717]

I remember taking my Hellcat to a road course event my first time. It was a blast hitting the twisties, I'll never forget it. Sure our cars are mostly straight line dominant but it did surprise me for handling the corners the way it did in all track mode. It's not going to rival a smaller, lighter, much better handling platform but for the heavy car that it is, I'll give it the nod.

I can only imagine if I would have had a set of Toyo r888r tires on all four corners and more seat time how much better the car could have done.

When it came to the straights... I was hitting 150 mph plus and everyone in my group got out of my way as if I was Moses splitting the sea and I was coming like freight train passing everyone.

Op get an instructor and they will be able to show you what your car is really capable of at the limit. By looking at your posts it seems like your concern with your car isn't so much on how it handled through the turns... but the straight line acceleration from 90-160 mph plus.

I'm somewhat confused on that as well especially when you mentioned you weren't leaving a stock Charger 392 in the dust on the straights all that much when a Redeye should most definitely. 🤔

 

[superbeegugs]

What is the best settings on an large oval track? Sport or track?

 

[superbeegugs]

OK - it seems no one got what I was trying to say here - sorry.
I was underwhelmed as it took so long to accelerate from 90 mph to 165 mph - but now I see it is not me - it is what is expected).
So I looked at multiple Redeye top speed runs on Youtube and timed their results. It is clear that a Redeye (like mine) needs ~14 seconds to go from 90 mph to 165 mph. That was the same result at my Hellcat. So nothing wrong with my car. In these 14 seconds you (and Me) will use up ~2600 feet - which is what I observed on the 3,500 ft straightaway at Poconos. So going 0-90mph (about 7 seconds) is MUCH quicker than going 90-165 mph (about 14 seconds).

 

[Doublewide]

OK - it seems no one got what I was trying to say here - sorry.
I was underwhelmed as it took so long to accelerate from 90 mph to 165 mph - but now I see it is not me - it is what is expected).
So I looked at multiple Redeye top speed runs on Youtube and timed their results. It is clear that a Redeye (like mine) needs ~14 seconds to go from 90 mph to 165 mph. That was the same result at my Hellcat. So nothing wrong with my car. In these 14 seconds you (and Me) will use up ~2600 feet - which is what I observed on the 3,500 ft straightaway at Poconos. So going 0-90mph (about 7 seconds) is MUCH quicker than going 90-165 mph (about 14 seconds).

Were you surprised that the acceleration from 90-165 was slower than 0-90?

 

[DGatzby]

OK - it seems no one got what I was trying to say here - sorry.
I was underwhelmed as it took so long to accelerate from 90 mph to 165 mph - but now I see it is not me - it is what is expected).
So I looked at multiple Redeye top speed runs on Youtube and timed their results. It is clear that a Redeye (like mine) needs ~14 seconds to go from 90 mph to 165 mph. That was the same result at my Hellcat. So nothing wrong with my car. In these 14 seconds you (and Me) will use up ~2600 feet - which is what I observed on the 3,500 ft straightaway at Poconos. So going 0-90mph (about 7 seconds) is MUCH quicker than going 90-165 mph (about 14 seconds).

I can tell ya from the two sessions I ran this morning, these Redeye’s suck large in the heat! The DA is 4500’ that don’t help, but after a few laps this POS is pulling power due to excessive temps in the Cats and oil. I have seen oil temps over 290! Seems like over 275 it runs like hell anyway. We are not passing squat the way this is running. OP take it back to Dodge and tell them it don’t work HPDE driving on hot days. Cat overheat and inadequate oil cooler. I want my Hellcat back, these are not built to support the extra power with any additional cooling.

Anyone think a new C8 will be better? In our group that is 50/50 today. One is down, and I just dropped him at the Chev dealer. It can’t make it to the dealer from the track. It is parked at a gas station.

 

[matt someone with an SRT]

I’ll keep it simple. If your stock hellcat/Redeye intake air temp is over 100 degrees the car is cutting timing. If it’s over 140 degrees it’ll cut timing even further. I like running my car ideally when I can keep intake air temps under 100 degrees. Don’t forget to use the chiller to help cool it down!

 

[Vet Rider]

I was just tuning a redeye that was stock besides my tune. Well before the tuning process I asked for a completely stock log. He was going into cat over temp right away and the injector pulse width was going high enough it was pulling power from the car. I can about guarantee this is your issue.
At the end he picked up good power by just fixing that issue.

Lol it has begun. I've been saying this for months now since I got my 21 and experienced it all winter here in FL trying to race mine.

These 21+ cars are gimped now from the factory with the updated calibrations for COT. As stated you need a tune now to raise those temp thresholds to something you wont ever hit.

 

[Vet Rider]

This is what it looks like when you hit COT. This was on the highway coming home from an evening at the dragstrip. Watch the boost.

 

[Vet Rider]

For comparison, when mine hit cot it was making 535rwhp on the dyno. After the tune on the same dyno it made 734rwhp. That was still completely stock except the tune all on 93 in 90*+ temps same dyno. Thats how bad COT was hitting. When the car was cold before the tune it made 655rwhp on that same dyno. This is a 21 normal HC Charger WB. NON RE.

 

[JMAbacus]

I can tell ya from the two sessions I ran this morning, these Redeye’s suck large in the heat! The DA is 4500’ that don’t help, but after a few laps this POS is pulling power due to excessive temps in the Cats and oil. I have seen oil temps over 290! Seems like over 275 it runs like hell anyway. We are not passing squat the way this is running. OP take it back to Dodge and tell them it don’t work HPDE driving on hot days. Cat overheat and inadequate oil cooler. I want my Hellcat back, these are not built to support the extra power with any additional cooling.

Anyone think a new C8 will be better? In our group that is 50/50 today. One is down, and I just dropped him at the Chev dealer. It can’t make it to the dealer from the track. It is parked at a gas station.

Wow, I didn't plan to track (HPDE) any Redeye I purchase but this sure is interesting. I understand that heat is the enemy of power adder cars from drag strip experience and that high intake temps on a road course kill power. But your talking about power pulled for cat converter temps or oil cooling issues. So on a hot day in highway driving would it ever come into play or it's just pushing the car all out over time? So I get that you are PO'd but would the 717 HC really be any different? I just read so much about the larger supercharger, the power chiller, the beefed up internals, and the superior rear end and axles on the RE versus the Hellcat that I thought it was a no brainer that the RE was just a better engineered and superior car in every metric. So would you still say it's superior in every way except this one HPDE application?

 

[Doublewide]

This is what it looks like when you hit COT. This was on the highway coming home from an evening at the dragstrip. Watch the boost.

Holy shit!

 

[JMAbacus]

For comparison, when mine hit cot it was making 535rwhp on the dyno. After the tune on the same dyno it made 734rwhp. That was still completely stock except the tune all on 93 in 90*+ temps same dyno. Thats how bad COT was hitting. When the car was cold before the tune it made 655rwhp on that same dyno. This is a 21 normal HC Charger WB. NON RE.

Got it, so it's going to affect any type of HC be it RE or the 717 based on your car. I posted before I had a chance to read your response. So if you want to "fix" the problem you would have to tune a new car and void the warranty? No car is perfect so I guess hot weather is the enemy of the stock configuration?

 

[DGatzby]

Wow, I didn't plan to track (HPDE) any Redeye I purchase but this sure is interesting. I understand that heat is the enemy of power adder cars from drag strip experience and that high intake temps on a road course kill power. But your talking about power pulled for cat converter temps or oil cooling issues. So on a hot day in highway driving would it ever come into play or it's just pushing the car all out over time? So I get that you are PO'd but would the 717 HC really be any different? I just read so much about the larger supercharger, the power chiller, the beefed up internals, and the superior rear end and axles on the RE versus the Hellcat that I thought it was a no brainer that the RE was just a better engineered and superior car in every metric. So would you still say it's superior in every way except this one HPDE application?

I owned a 2015 Hellcat, it never overheated. I obviously spent too much money believing all the stuff about the beef. When it is much cooler outside (because the Redeye/Demon has NO additional cooling capability over a Hellcat) it does considerably better. I would say lapping any car may be the most challenging on any car. Yes, this Redeye has proved to me that it is considerably less durable on a road course.

As long as your temps are under 230 oil etc, it seems fine. On the street no way you will work it harder. A burnout and 10 seconds of WOT; no problem. Sustained WOT 15-20 minutes on a hot day, not happening. Had another driver call me last night, Redeye in FL this weekend. HPDE lapping. Converter error light.

Why am I so concerned about overheating? This car’s record is not very good under my foot on road courses…

Hallet OK 2020- Supercharger

Road America 2021- Cat converter followed by a supercharger and an engine.

Road America 2022 Cat converter

Brainerd Donnybrook 2022 Noting dramatic oil overheat temps; massive power reduction both before 285 degrees and as the driver must slow the car to avoid 2020, 2021 and 2022 failures again.

 

[Vet Rider]

Got it, so it's going to affect any type of HC be it RE or the 717 based on your car. I posted before I had a chance to read your response. So if you want to "fix" the problem you would have to tune a new car and void the warranty? No car is perfect so I guess hot weather is the enemy of the stock configuration?

100%. Thats exactly what I went through. At like 4k miles after having the dealer tell me there is nothing twice and they refusing to break the speed limit to verify my concerns, I had to pay Satera tuning to do a remote tune to fix this... Flipping BS that Dodge did this to the 21+ cars. If you have an early 2020 or older, you should be fine with the older calibration unless you did that CAT recall they are pushing hard to everyone. In that recall you get like new cats/02's and they reflash you to this newest calibration.