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All these unreasonable EPA / CAFE minimum mpg standards do is put American automakers at a huge disadvantage and cost the public a lot more money. It will do exactly jack sh*t to improve the environment. Such a load of crap. Unless you are making the remaining 95% of the world do the same thing then we have achieved NOTHING. Everyone else will continue to depend on cheap and reliable fossil fuels while the American public is essentially forced to buy an electric car that virtually no one wants. We need to vote these morons out of office and get back to domestic oil and gas production and LET THE MARKET DICTATE WHAT CARS ARE MADE! Biden and his administration is screwing us just about every way possible.
Ah but much of it IS global by default. Many manufacturers are going 100% EV (Cadillac, Volvo, etc.) so it doesn't matter what country you're in. More will follow. The auto industry doesnt revolve only around the US…
 

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I suspect those f150 lightenings are huge adm. They are here in town. Chevy Silverado etrucks are 50+ including adm.

I bet you can't actually drive one away and have it in the driveway for less than 50+

Prove me wrong......
Saw one with 157 miles on it at the dealer only wholesale auction last wk, $106k. Wonder what they’ll mark it up to.
 

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You said you take issue with some of the opinions (educated opinions based off of the world i live in and predicting outcomes based off of history and theory) I stated but I dont really see any counter arguments made by you that make anything I said invalid.
1. Going off of polling today the percentage of Americans with a strong interest in or planning to buy an EV within the next few years is extremely low. And planning to buy an EV and actually forking over the money to buy one is two different things. I don't know a single person that owns an EV or plans on buying one. Granted, I own a collectible, used, and antique gun store so the people I have contact with tend to be conservative.
2. They should. That's part of the problem.
3. I said that lithium mining destroys the environment, which it does. The way it has to be mined is particularly invasive. Whether it happens in the U.S. or across the world it is still destructive.
4. Again there is no denying the effect it will have on gas stations and everyone involved with them. And just like Tesla, Rivian, and all if the other EV manufacturers, they have to be serviced by the manufacturer as they are security encoded to keep everyone else out. Say goodbye to more 90% of the auto repair business in any model where EVs are main form of transportation.
5. We agree
6. We are very far away from this technology at this point. Yet they are trying to force it on the public.
7. I don't care about foreign goods and their trade value. I care about how American goods can compete in the world economy. These ridiculous fuel costs that are self imposed by our own government not only affects the ability of some to fill up their cars gas tank but adds considerable cost to the manufacture and transportation of goods. It puts us at a huge disadvantage to countries who remain using fossil fuels which is damn neR the entire rest of the developed world!
8. I'm not sure what your argument is here against the statement I made. Apparently our government IS concerned with what cars we buy because they are trying to legislate their way into making us buy electric cars. My point is if they are successful in doing so what are they going to do for those that can't afford them? Tell them they have to walk or ride a bike instead of driving their ice powered car?
9. This one seems pretty easy to understand. We are but one tiny landmass in the world. We already had more restrictions on fossil fuel emissions than 98% of the world. The entire U.S. changing to EVs to the last man will have no measurable effect on stopping pollution if the rest of the world doesn't do the same thing. And that will never happen! Not in 100 years or 1000. It is a freaking pipe dream. Developing better emissions equipment that will reduce air pollution while keeping cheap fossil fuels is a far better plan than going electric. I could list 1000 reasons why but most of them are common sense and/or self-evident.
I'm neither for or against EV’s yet. For me the jury is still out. So while I agree with most of your points I do think numbers 2, 8, and 9 can be debated.
2. Very debatable. People just fear change. Sometimes with good reason, other times not so much. Without change we would live in the dark age still.
8. So far no one has said anyone cannot or will not be able to drive their ICE cars ever. That is just fear based projecting at this point. Also without question costs will come down on EV’s obviously as they become more mainstream as with literally any other transportation in history. Looking back to when cars were first invented, only wealthy people could afford one. And now look. Flying, trains, it’s universal.
9. I see the argument about the pointless tiny US impact quite a bit. The fly in the ointment there is that manufacturers are jumping on the bandwagon by going 100% EV only (Cadillac, Volvo just to name two). Meaning by default it isnt just here in the US. It certainly wont be limited to the US. There’s a whole world outside of our little bubble. If anyone anywhere wants a Volvo it will only be an EV. It will spread globally as more and more only produce EV’s. Hell even Lamborghini is starting to build them. It cant happen overnight and because of that many people think it cant happen at all. Range and charging will improve and newer generations wont care about ICE’s at all.
I do agree that unless the manufacturing process is also clean then it makes no sense. So many cons currently, I can see many of the pros too though. Currently I’m just hopefully observing and wont hit the panic button quite yet. Hovering though lol.
 

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change should stand side by side with choice. Not be forced onto a free society by the government. henry ford made a model t and sold lots of them. He then made the model A and people saw it was better and it made the model t an antique. What would have happened back then if the government said all model ts have to go. After a certain date your no longer allowed to own them. You MUST buy a model A because it has a better more efficient motor. I say get the govenment out of the picture and let the people tell the manufactures by what they go to a lot and buy instead of some hypocrite in dc that pollutes more in a week then i do in a year telling me I HAVE to buy something because if i dont some of the wacko people that are his followers wont vote for him anymore. Thats the truth plain and simple. They dont care about global warming. They care about votes and power.
Again, I'm not for or against EV’s yet but no one has said there’s a certain date that ICE’s have to be taken off the road and that you cant own one. Maybe new yes. But theyre not taking away people’s cars lol. That argument makes no sense to me. I’m not even sure how that is part of the discussion.
You're currently free to not buy an EV or to not buy an ICE powered car. You’re also free to vote.
Also I'm not sure how pissing off half of the nation is garnering votes and power. It would be a lot easier to avoid EV’s altogether and not alienate roughly half of your potential votes imo. If it is indeed getting votes then that tells me that the people have spoken and even if it’s somehow a scheme, at the very least we’re seeing that people actually do want EV’s. It’s simple, use your own power - vote.
 

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um maybe you should look at the law passed in CA. Maybe watch your president and vice president in speeches saying there going to force the phasing out of fossil fuel cars and trucks. I do agree with your last sentence though. Its the vote that will change this and in a couple months your going to see it CHANGED. I dont know how any free american would or could condone the government telling us what kind of cars we drive. Or using there power to force it through back doors like artificially inflating the price of gas. Or giving out my tax money to people who dont need it to buy a car so they buy what those polititians want us to buy.

Or by putting epa limits on pollution they create while doing nothing about the pollution created by evs. Not even forcing them like they do fossil fuel powered cars and trucks to meat fuel economy standards. They dont even have to prove there range ratings. Just pull them out of the air. Heck they want you to think they run for free and cause no pollution. Anyone with a 3rd grade education knows thats bunk!! If you cant see this as a conspiracy i feel sorry for you.

Whole thing reminds me of legalized pot for medicine. ANY OTHER drug has to pass years of testing for side effects and dangers. Even a pack of cigarettes has a surgeon general warning on it. Pot? No testing what so ever. No warning it can cause lung cancer. NOTHING. Not even any controls on how its grown. What is used to fertilize it. It could be fertilized by human feces and you would never know. What chemicals are in it when they make it into candy ect. Why? because our government is run by hippys from the 60s and again will do anything for votes.
I agree with some of that. But the CA law will phase out new ICE’s, not cars already on the road. I get what you're saying though, in the end it does basically phase ICE out altogether. Im not convinced it’s strictly for votes though. For me I guess it’s just not that black and white. Yet. I think there are arguments on both sides and the truth is prob somewhere in the middle.
 
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