Has anybody tried the Killer Chiller from Kincaid Performance? The Mustang guys seem to really like it. Claim 40 to 50 HP thru cooler intake temps and less timing retard. Now making a Hellcat kit.
Killer Chiller
James White
81 - 100 of 307 Posts
Stock intercooler coolant capacity is 4.5 quarts or 1.25 gallons. Without an additional reservoir tank(s), I think net capacity might actually be lower after bypassing both LTR heat exchangers and after adding the KC. What options are out there for adding capacity besides custom fabrication?
I saw a 2 gallon reservoir tank on Facebook but I didn't like how they cut into the front impact bar to mount it. Likely I will install my KC with the drag kit and the HE bypass but with no additional capacity. While I have the bumper off, I'll make some plans for adding it later. Even though I'll have the ability to bypass the HE, I suspect I won't be using it much after I'm done testing the configuration.
I'd seen that Kincaid sells an electric Bypass as well as a manual. It looks like it'd be cheaper to just buy a manual 3-way Bypass valve, barbs, clamps, and Heater hose for around $40. I haven't looked at the heat exchanger tubing yet, will likely do so this weekend.
How would you go about placing this bypass valve? Since I wouldn't be running the A/C in the winter it seemed like the bypass was the route to go rather than completely removing the Heat exchanger from the cooling loop.
BTW I did talk to the Owner, Joe Kincaid about some of the questions on refrigerant and tubing and he was a good resource and seemed more than happy to help if anyone ran into any issues.
He also gave me a coupon code if you buy a KC from their site you can save $50 - DH2
Still waiting on mine to arrive.
I have the manual bypass coming in my order. I used a different code though, DH1, also saves $50, free shipping, and includes a free HE bypass kit.
I imagine you would have to route a 2nd coolant line that skips the two heat exchangers where it gets tee'd before and after the HEs. Before the HEs would be the bypass valve that you turn manually to change the flow path. One problem is accessing the valve if it's mounted anywhere in the front bumper. I'm going to try to put it closer to the bottom where I can reach it from underneath the car without too much trouble.
Maybe i''m just dense but why would we want to bypass the Heat Exchanger only to to replace it with a Chiller Tank? Wouldn't that be the same as not bypassing the H/E thereby raising the temperature of the fluid if a majority of it is just sitting in the hot engine bay?
I'm going by Computer Watercooling (Which is not below ambient or using a refrigerant under pressure and maybe that's the major difference here) But the difference between me having a water pump drawing fluid in and out of a 5 gallon jug of water vs a 200ml reservoir wouldn't change the water temperature by any significant degree.
I guess after thinking about it it might prolong the amount of time it takes before the loop reaches working equilibrium. But at that point it would just mean more coolant is at the same temp, right?
I'm going by Computer Watercooling (Which is not below ambient or using a refrigerant under pressure and maybe that's the major difference here) But the difference between me having a water pump drawing fluid in and out of a 5 gallon jug of water vs a 200ml reservoir wouldn't change the water temperature by any significant degree.
I guess after thinking about it it might prolong the amount of time it takes before the loop reaches working equilibrium. But at that point it would just mean more coolant is at the same temp, right?
As you already know, a heat exchanger works by cooling liquid down towards ambient temps but unless something else funky is happening, it can't ever go below ambient. Add a Killer Chiller to the mix and now it's cooling fluid down significantly below ambient so when this cold fluid passes back through a heat exchanger, the HE works against the Killer Chiller by transferring heat back into the fluid to bring temps back up towards ambient. So, the idea behind bypassing the HEs is to allow the KC to work without being undermined by other components in the intercooler system.
As for extra capacity, it's been proven that by adding extra intercooler coolant capacity, IC coolant temps will rise slower when making a pass down the track. Science backed by real world results using many other different methods like ice tanks and increased capacity.
In regards to the KC, the A/C will shut off during WOT operation so the KC will no longer continue cooling after mashing the pedal. This means the rate of temperature rise of the IC fluid during a pass will be primarily dependent on the volume of coolant because the source and energy of the heat remains constant from the blower. In theory...
I think what you're missing is that our source of heat, the blower, is significant. Honestly though, I've never paid attention to IC temps at the track since I haven't figured out how to log it. My IATs though will start around 110-120 on a warm day and end in the 145-155 range after a pass.
Wouldn't it be awesome if we could figure out how to automatically bypass the HE's as long as IC temps are below ambient?
Maybe if I could seal the top and only have one path in and one path out. The shape would probably make it hard to place somewhere inside the bumper area, which would be my goal. If you had something else in mind, perhaps you can elaborate?
Ahh ok, this makes sense. Do you know if the A/C is shutoff by the PCM/BCM or is it a mechanical type shutoff if the Belt RPM's exceed X? If it were a PCM/BCM shutoff I'd think that could be tuned out. Not sure about the effects on a compressor with the clutch engaged with the belt turning at 5500rpm though.
The extra coolant to prolong raising temps does make sense now though, especially if the A/C compressor shuts off at WOT, thanks for the explanation.
Hopefully i'll know soon enough, I have my tablet with the HP Tuners connection, so that should def. be an item you could tag and record.
They do have one of those electric 3-way bypass kits, I would think adding an in-line temperature sensor could be wired into a relay or a computer (similar to a raspberry pi) that if the measured temperature exceeded a certain threshold (Temperature increase over time or something) would open the valve.
Pulling that info or IAT info from the PCM would be ideal but I think that'd be fairly difficult to do.
It's configurable in the tune. In my stock and modified tune, it's triggered based on throttle position. Factory settings will deactivate the A/C clutch when the pedal gets pushed beyond a specific threshold very close to WOT, at any RPM... I know, it's odd and it could just be that the tuning software doesn't have all the parameters exposed to see how other hidden parameters might also affect this behavior. Compressors are expensive so I wouldn't try to tune out this functionality. For drag racing, you only need to keep IATs low enough so the PCM doesn't pull timing.
Same here, let me know if you find the parameter to log IC temps. I keep looking and I keep finding new interesting things to log but not this...
Right on the money. ^^^^^^^This.
Just as a point of comparison, I see 85-90 deg IAT temps with chiller vs 120-140 and higher without it. The power potential and resulting tuning window (relative to timing and octane requirements) this difference creates is huge.
So far this set up has allowed me to get away with a an aggressive timing curve with 18-19 deg timing at WOT @ 15 psi on 93 Oct pump gas and some meth inj on top. Everytime I added 2 deg I picked up 1.5-2mph in the top end and I am not done yet as fine tuning the timing curve continues.
Datalogging is your friend and critical to understanding the value in changes such as these.
Big win for me as I would like to avoid having a "race only" tune and keep this thing on pump gas as I dive into the 9's.
Anyone have blower problems on the meth? Chemical cooling is always effective, so long as it doesn't chew up your rotors.
Got my Kit Friday, have a shop installing it now.
An update on the 1234yf to 134a refrigerant situation.
Long story short a friend in Indy was in a wreck with a 2016 SP and after getting the insurance check didn't want to pay the $600+ bill for charging refrigerant. After he rented the Gauge Manifolds and Vacuum he headed to one of our friends house with 2 12oz cans of 134a and 2 3oz cans of PAG46 oil. After about an hour or so we charged his system and he has been running it all weekend with no issues. I think it only got up to mid 80's this weekend but he said it is FAR colder than it ever was before and hasn't turned it down past 67* in the car.
I'll be doing the same to mine after I get mine back from the shop installing it.
I purchased this coupler set from Ebay which has since gone up in price. It used to be $50 but you can probably get a similar set. You will need them to interface with the 1234yf service ports.
Conversion Coupler Set Manifold Hose Tank Adapter Power Fit Mount Supply | eBay
Most of you guys may already know most of this but I sure didn't since I have almost no A/C experience prior to this project. Let me know if anyone has any questions
An update on the 1234yf to 134a refrigerant situation.
Long story short a friend in Indy was in a wreck with a 2016 SP and after getting the insurance check didn't want to pay the $600+ bill for charging refrigerant. After he rented the Gauge Manifolds and Vacuum he headed to one of our friends house with 2 12oz cans of 134a and 2 3oz cans of PAG46 oil. After about an hour or so we charged his system and he has been running it all weekend with no issues. I think it only got up to mid 80's this weekend but he said it is FAR colder than it ever was before and hasn't turned it down past 67* in the car.
I'll be doing the same to mine after I get mine back from the shop installing it.
I purchased this coupler set from Ebay which has since gone up in price. It used to be $50 but you can probably get a similar set. You will need them to interface with the 1234yf service ports.
Conversion Coupler Set Manifold Hose Tank Adapter Power Fit Mount Supply | eBay
Most of you guys may already know most of this but I sure didn't since I have almost no A/C experience prior to this project. Let me know if anyone has any questions
Here's a pic cruising on a 88 degree day. My ic coolant temps and iats are reversed since I did the Uconnect update so just switch those numbers.
I know radiator can, Lots of people do that when the swap to a 180 Thermostat. Not sure on Intercooler Pump.
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